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  1. #1
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    Question: Have you noticed any mechanical problems using ethanol/gas fuel blends?

    A technical study published in May by a group comprising a number of automakers (not BMW) and the petroleum companies suggests that while E10 seems okay for use in modern engines, E15 is not...http://www.greencarreports.com/news/...ker-study-says

    This is a call for real survey input by all of you running ethanol/gas fuel blends, presumably higher than E10 which comes out of most pumps these days. We all know we can get more power / more timing by adding up to about 50:50 gas: ethanol. But has anyone noticed any mechanical problems (leaking injectors, seals, etc.) which is suggested by the report? Alternatively, if you haven't noticed any mechanical problems, how much ethanol do you use (E30, E40, E50, etc.), how long have you used it, and about how many miles have you been running with ethanol? Also, have you used ethanol constantly or just intermittently?

    (Understood this is not completely scientific, but it's a start to help all of us.)

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    It's a good question but as I said in the other thread we have a relatively new list of people using E85. Regardless, let's see what they say.

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    Understood, sir.

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    I switched to E85 in my turbo M3 when I ran out of octane when going over 18psi on pump gas.

    Things that suck:
    -Availability. I'm in Houston.... A major metropolitan city. It's somewhat scarce. Good luck finding it out in the sticks!
    -moisture issues. Especially here in Texas with the humidity.
    -it likes to attack practically everything....plastics, metals, sensors, etc.... It's very aggressive.
    -When you swap over, the E85 will remove "gunk" and "junk" off the tank..... And clogged my filters multiple times. Over and over. Ymmv since my car has had gasoline for 14 years before hand. Currently I'm running a Weldon 100 micron Pre filter, and a 10 micron post filter. So far, so good. Previously I had dual Bosch motorsports 040 pumps in the tanks, and smoked 4 of them from clogging.$$$$$$$
    -its tricky to get it to start when cold..... The BTU content isn't as high as gasoline. I had some issues getting my tune right for it to start on a cold engine. Now its good to go
    -my car eats fuel like its a JOB lol.... My fuel mileage sucks!



    Things that are cool:
    -it loves boost.
    -it cools the cylinders due to the amount of fuel and alcohol content..... Cooler cylinder temps.
    -it doesn't smell like anything. No exhaust smells..... (Sneaky). Everyone knows to be cautious when you smell race gas and they chat it up about being a slow car Click here to enlarge
    -high octane content
    -makes my car a rocket.


    i use Lucas E85 fuel treatment with my fuel to help with lubricity

  5. #5
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by alex@ABRhouston Click here to enlarge
    it doesn't smell like anything. No exhaust smells..... (Sneaky). Everyone knows to be cautious when you smell race gas and they chat it up about being a slow car
    I like this...

    How do you keep it from clogging the fuel filters?

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    I like this...

    How do you keep it from clogging the fuel filters?
    (This was when I had the dual Bosch 040 pumps in it)
    It really sucks, but its just a matter of letting things run its course on older cars, I think. When I swapped from gas to E85, we were on the dyno and had run out of octane to continue tuning.
    We drained the tank, filled it with E85, drained it again, and filled it back up (to try and flush the gas out)
    We finished up dyno time and I brought it home.
    i had thought we were good to go.
    giddy with my new power, I went to go drive it a few days later. I laid into it, and it fell on its face. The Lambda gauge spiked, i let out.... and I watched the fuel pressure drop to zero under load..... Then it was hard to get it back to the house! It barely ran.
    i pulled the pumps, and they had this scum that looked like drier lint or something...... I thought it was weird. I brake cleaned the pump sumps and stuck it all back together.
    I did this about 30 minutes of engine run time again. Same scenario.
    and again....
    then the pumps were REALLY loud, and no matter what would not pump, even out of the car. They were damaged from cavitation (starvation thru the sump filter)
    so.....I repeated the whole thing.
    drained tank. Wiped it out. Replaced both pumps ($$$)

    it happened again Click here to enlarge
    So, I reinvented the wheel so to speak. I put a fuel-safe flexible road car surge tank, and put a -10 suction from the right side, to a Weldon 100 micron filter, a Weldon 2025 fuel pump (with a Weldon fuel pump controller that is controlled via Hobbs switch @ 2psi), 10 micron post filter and -8 line up to the rail (that is an expensive paragraph lol)

    i have out about 800-1000 miles on it now with this system, and have checked the Pre/post filters with little crud found.

    i honestly think it was just a waiting time of getting the scunge off the side of the gas tank where gasoline left residue that E85 ate off.

    sorry for the long post lol
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    I won't use E85 in my car.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by alex@ABRhouston Click here to enlarge
    (This was when I had the dual Bosch 040 pumps in it)
    It really sucks, but its just a matter of letting things run its course on older cars, I think. When I swapped from gas to E85, we were on the dyno and had run out of octane to continue tuning.
    We drained the tank, filled it with E85, drained it again, and filled it back up (to try and flush the gas out)
    We finished up dyno time and I brought it home.
    i had thought we were good to go.
    giddy with my new power, I went to go drive it a few days later. I laid into it, and it fell on its face. The Lambda gauge spiked, i let out.... and I watched the fuel pressure drop to zero under load..... Then it was hard to get it back to the house! It barely ran.
    i pulled the pumps, and they had this scum that looked like drier lint or something...... I thought it was weird. I brake cleaned the pump sumps and stuck it all back together.
    I did this about 30 minutes of engine run time again. Same scenario.
    and again....
    then the pumps were REALLY loud, and no matter what would not pump, even out of the car. They were damaged from cavitation (starvation thru the sump filter)
    so.....I repeated the whole thing.
    drained tank. Wiped it out. Replaced both pumps ($$$)

    it happened again Click here to enlarge
    So, I reinvented the wheel so to speak. I put a fuel-safe flexible road car surge tank, and put a -10 suction from the right side, to a Weldon 100 micron filter, a Weldon 2025 fuel pump (with a Weldon fuel pump controller that is controlled via Hobbs switch @ 2psi), 10 micron post filter and -8 line up to the rail (that is an expensive paragraph lol)

    i have out about 800-1000 miles on it now with this system, and have checked the Pre/post filters with little crud found.

    i honestly think it was just a waiting time of getting the scunge off the side of the gas tank where gasoline left residue that E85 ate off.

    sorry for the long post lol
    This makes me concerned about running E85 and I'm not sure what I should do to be preemptive about issues.

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    I thought this wouldn't really be an issue on newer cars as there wouldn't be all the crud in the tankfor the ethanol to dislodge.

  10. #10
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    You would think! My tank looked completely clean on the inside, and when I wiped it with a tack cloth, nothing would come out Click here to enlarge

    then again, my car is a 98, yours are newer..... So less time for crud to show up
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    Ethanol is terrible for our cars, people will start seeing issues, even with lpfp and hpfp installed....I'm not going to touch the stuff
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    3 out of 3 members liked this post. Reputation: Yes | No
    I like this thread! Lots of good information already.

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    e85 is not gold you say? Where's everyone that's running 100% e85 with the vishnu flexfuel kit? That's been out for a bit now and I would think we would start hearing stuff if there was issues.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by continue5 Click here to enlarge
    e85 is not gold you say? Where's everyone that's running 100% e85 with the vishnu flexfuel kit? That's been out for a bit now and I would think we would start hearing stuff if there was issues.
    What ever came of that flexfuel kit? Or did it just fizzle like a lot of the claims?

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    What ever came of that flexfuel kit? Or did it just fizzle like a lot of the claims?
    I think a-lot of people skipped it and dropped in the 200$ walbro pump in due to cost,although I think most have picked up headaches as well due to the drop in's reliability and hoses popping off.. There are a few members running the flexfuel kit with great success though, @wedge has a few videos of him destroying some impressive cars with 100% e85.

  16. #16
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    I would LOVE to run a flex fuel sensor to determine E85 strength, but in the mean time just test my fuel every time I fill up. It's easy at the pump, I just squirt a little from the nozzle into a small container and test it at the house..... That way I know I'm not gonna hurt anything.

    if I could manage keeping my boost creep down, I would run pump gas at low boost (like 12-14), and run E85 when I want to destroy people at my current 28 Click here to enlarge
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    I LOVE E85 and now that it's summer, run it someone "regularly". I have had absolutely no mechanical problems while running either fuel or switching back and worth. Honestly the biggest pain in the ass is switching fuels because the COBB maps aren't flex fuel (it's either 100% 93 pump gas, or 100% E85). The only "problem" I've noticed is if I switch from my E85 Map to the 93 and leave too much E85 in the tank -- The idle will be a little off because the ethanol concentration is a little too high & the fueling is programmed accordingly. But I can easily overcome this by holding 1k RPMs until the engine finishes the cold start process & then everything will be completely fine.


    So long as you have a proper fueling system (parts built to spec for high ethanol concentrations) & appropriate tuning, there is NOTHING bad or damaging about running E85. You can easily look at some cars that strictly run E85, and then can attest there is nothing wrong with it as long as you take the necessary steps -- Perfect example, prodigymb & m3ntals 996s. @undercoverangie can also prob have Garth comment on how safe running E85 is, from a tuner & builder's perspective.
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    The question is how many guys have the proper fuel system for E85? The stock parts aren't designed for it. If you build for it, sure, no problem.

  19. #19
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    So what is undercover changing on the n54 to run high concentrations of e85?
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by bobS Click here to enlarge
    So what is undercover changing on the n54 to run high concentrations of e85?
    Aren't they messing around with the Vargas pump?

  21. #21
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    I dunno, I would assume the lpfp, hpfp and fuel lines need to be changed.....but I'm not sure. I will have stg 2 turbos by the end of the summer and might want to run some e85... @undercoverangie
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  22. #22
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    The question is how many guys have the proper fuel system for E85? The stock parts aren't designed for it. If you build for it, sure, no problem.

    Well, from personal experience..... If you want to make fuel lines rated for E85, get ready to break out your wallet. Really the only fuel line designed in the aftermarket world (earl's PTFE lined braided hoses), and its about 6-8 dollars a foot for -6 line... And -8 is 8-10/foot. Add in special fitting ends at 15-70 dollars each, and things get expensive quickly.

    when I built my system, E85 wasn't used much, and there wasn't anything really available in the aftermarket world. If there was, it was ridiculously expensive. I settled on using Earls prolite 350 hose and anotuff end fittings.


    Earl's only approves E85 with their PTFE hose, last time I called and asked.
    all of my Weldon fuel pump stuff is E85 approved. It's very expensive, but it is the BEST.

    So far, with 2 years of straight E85, no leaks/swelling/deforming or other issues noted.
    now, the -10 suction line I have in the tank (its just a length of prolite in the surge tank) is slightly softer than when I put it in there (fuel system inspection was done about 2 weeks ago, so this is recent information) but nothing to show concern.
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  23. #23
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    Is the fuel line and fittings the main things needed? What else would I need?

    I'm planning on running FTW Purple.

  24. #24
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    Anything it touches practically. Are you going to go with an aftermarket fuel system?
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  25. #25
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by alex@ABRhouston Click here to enlarge
    Anything it touches practically. Are you going to go with an aftermarket fuel system?
    Yes, I'm running an aftermarket fuel system.

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